Thursday, March 1, 2018

Sittin’ ‘round talkin’ ‘bout THE BLACK ROOM:*


 *DISCLAIMER: We (Mermaid Heather, Zombie Dawn and myself) may be sittin’ ‘round talkin’ but, thanks to the magic of the internet we’re NOT in the same room. Also, my apologies for blatant Apostrophe Abuse Syndrome (AAS) here. 
This conversation was cut and pasted from a Facebook message conversation, and additionally edited by me, Terry Kimmel aka Cattleworks.
Also, you can read Mermaid Heather’s, Zombie Dawn’s and my own review for THE BLACK ROOM at the links.
NOTE: When we had this conversation, I still hadn’t posted my review for THE BLACK ROOM and hadn’t read ZOMBIE DAWN’s review.
Also, WARNING: This conversation about the movie does CONTAIN SPOILERS! So, read at your own peril if you haven’t seen the film yet!
Enjoy!


ZOMBIE DAWN: We have all arrived for the powwow.
MERMAID HEATHER: Yay!
ZOMBIE DAWN: 5 minutes into that movie, I wasn’t sure if I could do it.
MERMAID HEATHER: Why would that be, Dawn?
CATTLEWORKS: Oh, dear! Sorry, Dawn! (considering I picked the movie)
ZOMBIE DAWN: Oh, the acting first off kinda put me off, then like I said in my review, I kinda fell in love with it for just that reason!
The credits totally reminded me of that old show Amazing Stories. Do you guys remember that show?
CATTLEWORKS: Oh, I wasn’t thinking of that, but now that you mention it, yes, I see the similarity.
MERMAID HEATHER: I didn't watch it much, but yes I remember it.
ZOMBIE DAWN: And the guy that who played Paul (Lukas Hassel). Loved his acting. It was a lot of fun.
MERMAID HEATHER: I agree with you there, Dawn, he was my favorite of the bunch.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Hahaha!! That scene!! With Karen in the bedroom and him trying to seduce her!!
Tell me that wouldn’t have gone differently, hahaha!!
She seemed like “yeah, whatever”.... whaaaaaat?!
CATTLEWORKS: I’ll be honest, I was on the fence and I was curious what Heather thought about the film, so I took a quick peek at her review. I was just curious what you thought, Heather, because I know you like (writer/director) Rolfe Kanefsky.
But I was kind of thumbs down.
ZOMBIE DAWN: I can totally see that.
But I also like films like BAD TASTE.
CATTLEWORKS: The film was very inconsistent for me and the things that bugged me kind of got the better of me.
Well, I feel I’m inconsistent as a reviewer as well, so I’m really self-conscious when I get critical. But a few little things kept happening at the beginning, and so the film was sort of trying to get out of the hole it dug, for me, anyway.
ZOMBIE DAWN: I hear ya!
MERMAID HEATHER: I was in the middle for the most part. I can see why people don't like the film, but it isn't that far off from Kanefsky's other films, so I guess I was more forgiving.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Hahaha, yeah I wrote and then deleted a lot of stuff that I thought was too critical.
I have a lot of respect for filmmakers and the work that goes into the craft.
I’ll have to look at your review again for those titles, Heather.
CATTLEWORKS: But I liked Lukas Hassel as Paul, too.
ZOMBIE DAWN: And the guy in the beginning... plumber? HVAC guy? Would he really be so bold?
CATTLEWORKS: I think you mean the furnace guy. The plumber guy is the one who gets decapitated.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Hahaha!!! I met the plumber guy (James Duval)!!! He’s super nice!!
At a con, of course.
MERMAID HEATHER: At one of your conventions?
ZOMBIE DAWN: Yeah, I think it was Crypticon. Maybe 4-5 years back.
MERMAID HEATHER: I hope you get to meet him again, loved that death scene.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Yeah!!! I totally didn’t expect that, haha!!
CATTLEWORKS: Yeah, Robert Donovan who played the furnace dude, he was interesting because I think when he was coming on to Jennifer, I think that was meant as comedy, but it came across more genuinely creepy. I actually thought the actor was good, but the tone was more serious than you would expect.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Agreed, Terry.
How about the end scene?
Did you guys call it?
CATTLEWORKS: Wait, which end scene? The very end with Paul and Jennifer in bed?
ZOMBIE DAWN: Haha, yeah Terry.
I was like “ohhhhh, here comes the evil eyes,” hahaha!
MERMAID HEATHER: There was an end scene after the credits, too.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Oh shit! Really?
Dang!!!
I’ll have to watch and amend my review then!
MERMAID HEATHER: I was a little surprised by the scene you were talking about, but it didn't feel like a big shock.
ZOMBIE DAWN: I totally called it, based on the movie as a whole.
CATTLEWORKS: I thought that was a good way to end it. A pseudo-YOUNG FRANKENSTEIN reference (not really) re: Paul’s “equipment” and then Jennifer’s look to the camera, which was great.
MERMAID HEATHER: The after credits scene is just Tiffany Shepis (who played the realtor) giving her speech to a new owner.
It wasn't much really.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Ahhhh.... but would that work? With the incubus inside of Jennifer now?
I’d think the house would just be a house again.
MERMAID HEATHER: Well, there is the gateway there so maybe it would still want to use the house.
ZOMBIE DAWN: True that. All the sigils and whatnot are there...
CATTLEWORKS: Yeah, that ending with Tiffany Shepis talking to the next buyers’ of the house does seem to possibly contradict the ending with Jennifer now being possessed.
Maybe they couldn’t make up their mind which ending worked best and decided to put them both in.
Based on your review, Heather, it seems people have been turned off by the sexual aspects of the film?
MERMAID HEATHER: It would seem so, Terry. Lot of reviews put down the soft porn aspect of it.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Honestly, I went in blind.
I had no idea it was an incubus.
Some of it was predictable, but some of it was WTF?
Just thought of that restaurant scene. Paul was on a roll there. I don’t think there was a woman safe from his influence...
But... boobs on the back? Oh jeez!
CATTLEWORKS: Hahaha! Yeah!
MERMAID HEATHER: I had to roll my eyes at that. It was kind of left hanging out there as well.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Hahahaha!!!
MERMAID HEATHER: Although, she did say she wanted her boobs back.
ZOMBIE DAWN: OMG, you’re right!!!
Hahahaha!!!
CATTLEWORKS: Hahaha! I’ve only seen Kanefsky’s THE HAZING a few years ago, so I chalk that up to Kanefsky’s sense of humor.
ZOMBIE DAWN: What was the line that made you laugh from Lin Shaye, Heather?
MERMAID HEATHER: Just the way she told her granddaughter to put some clothes back on.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Hahaha!!
MERMAID HEATHER: With that opening scene, Terry, I was wondering if you were trying to turn us on so we would talk dirty to you during this conversation, lol.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Bwahahaha!!!!!
CATTLEWORKS: Actually, I was feeling very self-conscious and I imagined you guys in the same room watching the film with me—not in a comfortable way, he said blushing.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Lol, Terry!!
Oh, and I totally had that thought, too, Heather! About THE ENTITY. Like you mentioned in your review.
(Re: the ending) After Lin Shaye’s character helped Jennifer there in the end, I was rolling!
She looked like she was totally at home, just chillin’ and not in an embryonic sac having the life leeched from her!
CATTLEWORKS: Haha! I thought Jennifer biting that umbilical cord was pretty funny.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Oh my god, I loved it!!!
MERMAID HEATHER: I hope she doesn't bite while doing something else.
CATTLEWORKS: Heather: Oh, dear.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Hahahaha Heather!!!!
And when she’s pushing that umbilical back in?!? Her line “sometimes you have to. PUSH. HARD.”
I was like “ok, I just can’t even with that.”
Hahahaha!!
CATTLEWORKS: Yeah, it took me a minute to figure out what exactly she was doing—it turned out to be a “vacuum thing”.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Ahhh, hahaa!!
CATTLEWORKS: I thought Lukas Hassel was great and I liked Natasha Henstridge as well.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Oh yeah, and I agree with Heather. (Natasha Henstridge’s) acting has improved.
Duty calls. Time to pick the girl child up from work.
Thanks for including me, guys!
CATTLEWORKS: I’ll definitely finish and post my review tonight.
ZOMBIE DAWN: Can’t wait to see it!
CATTLEWORKS: I’m glad you can participate. I look forward to reading your review.
MERMAID HEATHER: Glad that you could join us!
ZOMBIE DAWN: Thank you!

(Zombie Dawn leaves conversation)

CATTLEWORKS: Do you have to head out as well, Heather?
MERMAID HEATHER: I can stay longer if you wish.
CATTLEWORKS: Cool.
While working on my review earlier today, I was re-watching parts of the film. Part of me was wondering if I was just being grumpy or tired or just out of it when I first watched it, and that’s why I didn’t like it as much as I did, but I was still distracted by the same bits when I re-watched it. Having said that, the parts I liked, I also still liked. So, I think the film is genuinely a mixed bag, and on top of it is the sexual aspect of the film. Which I had no problem with. Except for my aforementioned self-consciousness…
MERMAID HEATHER: lol You know I would have to give you a hard time if we were watching it in the same room.
CATTLEWORKS: OMG, considering the context of this conversation, that doesn’t sound right, hahaha!
I didn’t realize Kanefsky did the EMMANUELLE films that were on Skinamax, although doing an IMDb search on Robert Donovan, I see he was also in those. I’ve seen some of those films in part, which explains why he looked familiar to me. Mostly, I was struck by Donovan’s voice. I thought he had a cool voice.
MERMAID HEATHER: What bugged you the most about the movie?
CATTLEWORKS: You know, it was really small, specific things, and I felt like a jerk even talking about them in my review.
Weird shit. Trivial shit, but I found it distracting enough that it bugged me.
Or, I should say, it took me out of the film. Like, when the grandmother is arguing with the demon at the beginning, the film cuts back and forth between that argument and also the demon preying on the granddaughter. I found that confusing.
MERMAID HEATHER: I get you. As I said, it wasn't the soft porn part of the story that made me like this movie less, but smaller things as well. Mostly it had to do with the story.
If it was sexual energy the demon wanted/needed...why kill nearly everyone to get it? I'm pretty sure a dead body isn't thinking sexual thoughts anymore.
CATTLEWORKS: Yeah, that’s inconsistent, too.
When the furnace man is sort of fondling Jennifer at the washer, I get the idea but it was also strange how they were getting that idea across, too. Like, I thought it worked, but not really. I get what they were doing, but for some reason I was getting hung up on how they were showing it. So, I more or less was biding my time watching this sequence.
And a lot of things were kind of technical, I guess.
Like, for instance, when the furnace man is being dragged backwards in the doorway, and his one hand is being caught in the door (and the door is closing on his fingers) and he’s screaming. Part of me is thinking, okay, I see what’s going on, yes, that would be painful. But, part of me was also wondering why I was kind of detached, like, I was registering all this intellectually, rather than being emotionally moved. Because that’s a horrible thing having a door closing on your fingers like that! That should be a really squeamish moment for the audience, seeing that and imagining how that would feel. I think (we, the audience, don’t feel that) because you don’t really see the edge of the door closing on the guy’s fingers. And I was still thinking about that scene today (I re-watched that scene last night) and I’m wondering why they shot it that way. Of course, this is a very subjective question. Most people would think there wasn’t a problem in the first place! But, I have a possible reason why it was shot the way it was. They had to rig the door in such a way that they could close it and also have the actor’s fingers in the way. So, I’m assuming they widened the gap between the door and where it’s hinged to the frame. If you shoot it from the angle they shot it at, it looks like the door is closing in on the man’s fingers. But if you shoot it where it would look the most painful, with the door pressing on the fingers as it’s trying to close, they can’t because the gap is wider now so you’ll see that the door isn’t even touching his fingers now (I’m assuming). Does that make sense? Yeah, stupid shit like this is what grips my thoughts!
OMG, this is as interesting as, well, like trying to explain a joke! Sorry sorry sorry!
MERMAID HEATHER: You are fine. I get what you are saying about it and I agree.
CATTLEWORKS: It was cool seeing Dominique Swain in the film. It’s been so long since I’ve seen her in a film, I couldn’t figure out why the actress looked familiar, hahaha!
Although, I had issues with Stacy (Dominique Swain’s character) thinking that her husband, Howard (Caleb Scott) ate too much, because he really didn’t look that fat, and that distracted me, too.
MERMAID HEATHER: I know but everyone has their idea of how fat someone should or shouldn't be.
CATTLEWORKS: Yes, but for me, him not being obviously overweight to some degree sort of complicated the joke, tho’ you can also interpret it that Stacy just has hang-ups. Having said that, the idea of her being sexually repressed works when Paul says that to her when he’s sucking her sexual energy out.
You know, re-watching the parts made me also enjoy the parts I did like.
MERMAID HEATHER: I watched it Friday night after work so I was feeling tired when I started it. At times I would perk up and get into the movie and there were times when I started feeling very tired again.
CATTLEWORKS: I was shocked when Paul kills Karen during sex! I was like, really!? She seemed like a strong character. Of course, I didn’t expect to see her again, but then she does re-appear in a significant way.
MERMAID HEATHER: Having the dead help the demon was kind of an odd choice to me.
I could see them getting possessed and helping.
CATTLEWORKS: Yeah, I think there were some plot choices that made no logical sense but seemed like a cool thing to do in a genre film.
It was weird. I think I’m usually a much more forgiving audience for a film, especially a genre film, but I guess I also become fixated on things almost arbitrarily.
MERMAID HEATHER: I liked Karen. Her line after seeing Paul naked cracked me up.
CATTLEWORKS: Yeah! Her makeup seemed a bit over the top, but I think that was for comic effect.
MERMAID HEATHER: At first I thought she was just that pale, but in close-ups you can see the makeup. She looked a lot better once they no longer did that.
CATTLEWORKS: I felt there was genuine tension in the first conversation between Paul, Jennifer and Karen. I thought Karen was a real horrible person for no reason, and her explanation after the fact when she’s alone with Jennifer seemed a little too late. I had to warm up to her, although when Paul’s possessed and eyeing all the waitresses blatantly, Karen’s reactions seemed more understandable.
The flashback to the party in the basement in the 70s was fun for nostalgic reasons, although the outrageousness of complete strangers coming to a party and having this demonic ceremony out of the blue is absurd, but I think that’s for comic effect, too. Sort of like, “of course, strangers would do this, it’s a horror movie!”
Although, I’m also thinking, you tell the woman to stay in the circle AFTER she runs out? D’oh!
Is that whole Spirit Board reference an INSIDIOUS in-joke? I’ve never seen the movies, but after the fact, I was wondering.
MERMAID HEATHER: I don't recall there being one in that movie, but it has been a long time since I watched it.
CATTLEWORKS: I only wondered because I only know of Ouija boards and so I wondered what the hell a Spirit Board was. It also seemed to be out of the blue since it never really affects the plot at all.
Yeah, I was going back and forth between picking THE BLACK ROOM and DON”T KILL IT. Mike Mendez directed DON’T KILL IT, but then I wasn’t sure how much of a horror film it was. But, considering you like Rolfe, I went the Kanefsky way.
MERMAID HEATHER: You didn't have to but I'm glad that you did. May have taken me longer to have gotten around to it otherwise.
CATTLEWORKS: The one interesting thing about this movie, I think, is contemplating how sexual subject matter is perceived in film now, especially with the recent #MeToo movement. I don’t mean to be political, but I think it’s a sign of the changing cultural landscape in terms of how much subject matter is responded to now.
Nudity was a sort of given decades ago when Roger Corman was regularly producing drive-in fare. Nudity and violence were simply exploitable plot elements.
I was thinking about this as I was writing my review especially when I was talking about the granddaughter being visited by the demon in the prologue.
MERMAID HEATHER: True. I think in some ways the movement has been taken too far, but that is a different conversation.
I have never been much of a fan of a horror/soft porn cross, but I have nothing against anyone that does enjoy it. Going into this film, and realizing quickly where it was somewhat going, I wasn't sure how much I would like it.
CATTLEWORKS: Yes, that is a different conversation. But, mores have genuinely changed, too. I started to write in my review that the demon “seduces” the young woman as she sleeps, but that’s a euphemism. He’s actually assaulting her. But she doesn’t realize it, because she’s enjoying it, and it’s implied that she thinks she’s enjoying an erotic dream. From a male perspective, it’s enjoyable to watch because it’s a naked attractive woman enjoying sexual pleasure, so the voyeuristic button is being pushed.
The scene where Paul (possessed by the incubus) attacks Karen works with a sort of mainstream horror audience, too, I think, because they’re pushing the monster aspect more. If it was straight-up assault, it would have changed the tenor of the film entirely, I think, and for the worse. Although, you pointed out that there apparently is some criticism of the porn element, anyways. Although, it shows how jaded I am, because the porn aspect didn’t seem that pornographic, haha!
MERMAID HEATHER: No, it didn't. The opening scene borders on it, but as Dawn pointed out, it reminded us both a lot of THE ENTITY so maybe that is what Kanefsky was nodding at for that scene.
CATTLEWORKS: I thought the special effects for that scene were pretty impressive.
MERMAID HEATHER: Was it the effects you were truly impressed by? lol
CATTLEWORKS: Yes, your honor!
Impressive because they seemed believable.
So, I have to track down Kanefsky’s first film now, THERE’S NOTHING OUT THERE.
And I’ve never seen NIGHTMARE MAN.
MERMAID HEATHER: What is taking so long?
CATTLEWORKS: Look who you’re talking to!
What else have you seen by him? We both saw THE HAZING. Have you seen anything else?
MERMAID HEATHER: Just NIGHTMARE MAN and now this movie as far as I can tell.
CATTLEWORKS: Okay.
Well, anything else you wanna say or discuss about THE BLACK ROOM?
MERMAID HEATHER: Just one other thing. While I was confused about the feeding, I was pretty impressed by the set they came up with for that.
CATTLEWORKS: Yeah, it was very imaginative. In a completely different way, I also thought the flashback party scene was fun and imaginative, too. I also thought Karen’s make-up was great when she was killed. I thought Dawn Black (the granddaughter character)’s burn makeup on her face was alright, though. I felt it should’ve been worse. Or, at least, her hair should’ve been shorter or completely gone (although, granted, we see her two years after the furnace incident). Man, I was just a difficult audience throughout this film, haha!
Also, I didn’t realize that “incubus” and “succubus” were gender-related terms. The first is a male demon, the second female.
MERMAID HEATHER: How long have you been a horror fan again? lol
CATTLEWORKS: Maybe too long! Maybe I knew it and forgot it!
MERMAID HEATHER: Sounds like a good excuse to me, lol
CATTLEWORKS: Well, I guess we’re done then for tonight?
MERMAID HEATHER: I guess so. It was fun talking to you and Dawn about this movie. I'm looking forward to the next one.  :)
CATTLEWORKS: Hey, we did two of these things! That’s some crazy-ass crazy-assery!
Thanks for talking a little longer!
MERMAID HEATHER: No problem. Talk to you again soon.
CATTLEWORKS:  :)


There ya go! My apologies to Mermaid Heather and Zombie Dawn for taking so damn long to post this! My editing process wasn’t the most practical.
Meanwhile, the reviews for our next "Netflix connection” movie should be posted March 11. Zombie Dawn’s pick for our next film is: THEY LOOK LIKE PEOPLE (2015), written and directed by Perry Blackshear.

PS. Okay, I’ve tried a couple times to change the font-size on this post (going from “large" to “normal"), and each time I think I’ve done it, but when I look at the actual blog page, it hasn’t changed. Not at all! Also, the smiley face emoji, “  :)  ”  that I end the chat with, comes out as two different symbols. One looks like a computer monitor (?!) and something else... a phone? 
What the heck!

Unless it actually goes through THIS time...

#FeelinLessThanCompetentBlogwiseDammit 


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